My 2007 Vespa GTS 250

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Areomyst
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Re: My 2007 Vespa GTS 250

Postby Areomyst » Fri Apr 01, 2016 5:48 am

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The engine is coming back together nicely!



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My gearbox seal has been leaking, so I took a moment to replace it. I have a seal installation tool that is made for the modern Piaggio 2-stroke engines, and it just so happened that the tool worked perfectly for installing the gearbox seal.



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I have been long overdue for some CVT maintenance. I ordered the RMS pulleys from SIP instead of getting the OEM Piaggio parts because the RMS ones were so much more reasonably priced. I have to say that the RMS parts appear nearly identical to the OEM Piaggio ones! Right down to the TGB stamp. In the above photo, you can see how worn the pulleys were. This caused my top speed to be around 85mph indicated. Between the pulleys and the fresh(ish) drive belt, I should see higher speeds again.



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When I attempted to start the bike, it sounded really good except for one simple problem... it still wasn't starting! Shoot... Well, I had the CEL illuminated on the dash so I hooked up my Centurion scan tool.

This tool lacks a few of the functions that the OEM Piaggio computer has, but it's more readily available and reasonably priced! Check it out if you have a Piaggio or Aprilia 4-stroke injected scooter: http://technoresearch.com/ The tool hooks up to a USB port on the computer, and then two alligator clamps go to their corresponding posts on the battery and the tool then plugs into the wiring harness of the scooter. It can read codes and perform many troubleshooting functions. It's pretty cool! Thanks to Starreem for turning me on to this tool years ago! It's been a useful tool in the shop for a while now...



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In short order the Centurion prompted me that I had engine trouble! Shortly after I saw that the fuel injector had no load... Interesting. I followed the instructions in the Vespa service manual to check the wiring, relays, fuses, etc and finally tested the resistance of the injector itself. It read 14.x ohms, which is in spec. Shortly after that, becoming frustrated, I measured it again and got 0! I checked again a short while later and the damned thing read 25.x... Needless to say, it looks like I need an injector on top of all the work previously performed. What a run around!

I never noticed the CEL being illuminated, even when I tried to start the bike in the shop after the breakdown. To be honest, I don't think it WAS illuminated but perhaps I am mistaken... It looks like I had two problems with my scooter and only addressed the mechanical issue, as I was unaware of the fuel injector problem. I should have done the scan tool testing as a first step! As frustrating as it has been to go through this, and as embarrassing as it is to post things like the lost "packing", I wanted to do so anyway in case someone else going through similar repairs could hopefully learn from my errors...

So tonight, I am planning on borrowing an injector from Starreem. I will update the post to let you guys know how it goes!

Thanks for reading. :) I hope it has been at least mildly amusing for you folks. :P

~Josh
"The more a man learns, the more he realizes how little he knows."

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Areomyst
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Re: My 2007 Vespa GTS 250

Postby Areomyst » Fri Apr 08, 2016 7:47 am

I suspected that I had a failed fuel injector. I felt pretty sure that my old injector was damaged during the repairs I was making to the engine. I had left most of the wires connected to the throttle body and just kind of crammed it out of the way while I did my engine work - therefore the valves were certainly the original problem, and the injector issue was one created during the process of repairs. Cramming the throttle body/manifold assembly off to one side certainly didn't help matters and I suppose that I could have also started this whole mess when I pressure washed the engine a while back. The plug on the injector is far more delicate than I would have ever thought! It's funny to think that these tiny injectors are mounted on top of a 250cc engine and actuate some 4000ish times per minute and deal with all the temperature changes and vibrations and they hold up for tens of thousands of miles. Wiggle the plug with the force applied by a newborn kitten though, and it's dead!

I went out to Starreem's last weekend to borrow a known good injector from her. We tested the thing on her own GTS and the scooter started up and ran fine. By the time I got home, the injector was dead... I suspect that I killed it when I tossed it towards the passenger seat of the van I was borrowing... I missed and the injector hit the floor. Despite being wrapped up, I suppose that was enough to kill it. When I got back, it wasn't working. Needless to say, I'll be replacing her injector as well.

Before forking over good money on a brand new injector, I wanted to do multiple checks to make sure that these injectors were indeed bad. The first check that I did, was to simply remove the injector from the manifold leaving everything connected, and point the nozzle end into a graduated cup. I attempted to start the engine and witnessed no fuel coming from the injector. Next, I hooked up the Centurion scan tool and used the interface to activate the fuel pump for 30 seconds. During this time I used a spare battery and some jumper wires to attempt to actuate the injector. Still no fuel spray. Finally, I removed the injector and placed it on my workbench and used the same battery/jumper wire setup to attempt to manually actuate the injector while listening to it with a mechanic's stethoscope. I heard nothing on the stethoscope at all... I had some spare injectors kicking around on one of my old SAAB engines, so I performed the same 'bench test' on those, and could hear audible clicking each time I completed my makeshift circuit. I was confident at this point that the injector was indeed bad, and also (disapointingly) confident that I ham-fisted my friends injector while I was at it!

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Above: An example of the method I was using to bench test the injector. The plug on the injector is the same as many automotive injectors, so I plugged that into the injector, which made it easier to attach the jumper wires. When completing the circuit to test the actuation of the injector, I did so at the negative battery post. I did it this way to avoid sparks near the injector - it's gasoline that I'm working around, after all. :) Also, the ECU of the GTS completes the injector circuit via a grounding switch inside the computer anyway (to the best of my understanding) so I figured this was an acceptable way to carry out my test. The old injectors (as I've mentioned before) made no sounds. The new one was quite audible. In fact, I think someone with better hearing than I have would likely be able to hear the injector actuate without the stethoscope.



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Above: An example of leaving everything connected while pointing the injector nozzle into a cup... If ever you decide to perform the same test, be very careful! If the spark plug wire is disconnected or there is some other source of ignition in close proximity to the fuel you could easily have a fire... Anyway, I did this with the old injectors, and the new. The new injector happily sprayed fuel when I turned the engine over, whereas the old ones did not.


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Above: New fuel injector thanks to scooterwest.com!


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Above: The scooter runs again! I was able to perform a quick 30+ mile test drive, and the engine runs great! It's also nice to have a working fuel gauge. With the new RMS pulleys I am once again not hitting the rev limiter until I'm a hair under and indicated 90 MPH. The Jettin shock bushings seemed to solidify the rear suspension a bit, and during harder cornering the bike feels a touch more stable and predictable.

After almost 2 weeks of not having my main transportation, I'm really glad to have my Vespa back! While the Vespa was down, I ended up registering my Kymco People 50 and I was riding that again so that I could at least get around. It was a little bit of a bummer sometimes being back on the 50 and not being able to jump on the highway and cover long distances. That said, I still really enjoy the Kymco and I'm glad that I had it while the GTS was "in surgery"!

I hope that some of the information given in this thread is a help to some of you GTS owners some day! I'll update the thread when I get some interesting news on the bike, but it'll be a while (hopefully) before I do much in the name of wrenching on it. I hope that I can take it out to the Blue Ridge Parkway and get some good mountain riding done! Last time I was at the Blue Ridge Parkway was probably 6ish years ago, and I was riding the Kymco then. It was a very enjoyable ride. :)

Ciao!

~Josh
"The more a man learns, the more he realizes how little he knows."

johnnywheels
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Re: My 2007 Vespa GTS 250

Postby johnnywheels » Sun Apr 24, 2016 12:52 pm

Areomyst wrote:
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Above: The scooter runs again! I was able to perform a quick 30+ mile test drive, and the engine runs great! It's also nice to have a working fuel gauge. With the new RMS pulleys I am once again not hitting the rev limiter until I'm a hair under and indicated 90 MPH. The Jettin shock bushings seemed to solidify the rear suspension a bit, and during harder cornering the bike feels a touch more stable and predictable.

After almost 2 weeks of not having my main transportation, I'm really glad to have my Vespa back! While the Vespa was down, I ended up registering my Kymco People 50 and I was riding that again so that I could at least get around. It was a little bit of a bummer sometimes being back on the 50 and not being able to jump on the highway and cover long distances. That said, I still really enjoy the Kymco and I'm glad that I had it while the GTS was "in surgery"!

I hope that some of the information given in this thread is a help to some of you GTS owners some day! I'll update the thread when I get some interesting news on the bike, but it'll be a while (hopefully) before I do much in the name of wrenching on it. I hope that I can take it out to the Blue Ridge Parkway and get some good mountain riding done! Last time I was at the Blue Ridge Parkway was probably 6ish years ago, and I was riding the Kymco then. It was a very enjoyable ride. :)

Ciao!

~Josh


Hey Josh, lovin all the upgrades you've been making(especially the speedometer, really slick!}, she's looking like a real beauty! Appreciate all of the updates and looking forward to more in the future!

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Re: My 2007 Vespa GTS 250

Postby F10Pilot » Mon May 09, 2016 6:41 pm

Wow! Awesome write up Josh. I choked on my coffee at "somewhat easily" maneuver the fuel tank out!

Scoot looks great and I'll be checking out those shock bushings for sure. Awesome showroom post though try to keep us posted on this scoot I know at least one board member has one just like it.

Don't forget to get out of the shop and ride that thing 8)
Malaguti F10 - Flies like a butterfly - Sounds like a bee.

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Areomyst
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Re: My 2007 Vespa GTS 250

Postby Areomyst » Mon May 09, 2016 9:11 pm

F10Pilot wrote:
Don't forget to get out of the shop and ride that thing 8)


Thanks for the kind words man. Believe me, I'm trying to ride it more. :D Last night I hit 33,911 miles on the way to my buddy's machine shop. I've got 1,000 miles on the engine since the cylinder head was redone, and it's running pretty well! I'm pleased with it for sure. Daniel O got his Yamaha R6 back on the road last week, so we're going to go out for a ride tomorrow night after work I believe.

On another note, my daughter (7 years old) has finally gotten her proper riding gear, and absolutely loves riding with me. The first day we got the gear she insisted on going different places until finally we had reached the better part of 100 miles! I have to be honest, I was very nervous about having her on the back of the bike with me... I suppose that there's more assumed danger in riding the scooter than anything else we do together, but this kid does backflips on the trampoline, and does cartwheels and round-offs off of the edge of a balance beam in gymnastics. After a couple of good rides, some great bonding, and overall enjoyable experiences I have to say I'm glad we're doing it!

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I suppose that's a big difference from when I posted a picture of her at 5 months old!
Image

~Josh
"The more a man learns, the more he realizes how little he knows."

rpmorrell
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Re: My 2007 Vespa GTS 250

Postby rpmorrell » Tue May 10, 2016 4:18 pm

A tip on the new injector; I braced my new one with a small hose clamp to try stop the wiring from flexing it at the connector.
Of course check that the rest of the wires on the nearby loom aren't putting weight or stressing the injector when movement in the suspension or just dead weight & vibration.

Kind regards,
Rob :)


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